MIX CHALLENGE - MC37 October 2017 - Winners announced

Join the Mix Challenge - recurrence: February until December
fese
Posts: 51
Joined: Mon Apr 03, 2017 7:09 pm
Location: Bonn

Re: MIX CHALLENGE - MC37 October 2017 - Round 1 in evaluation

Post by fese » Tue Oct 24, 2017 6:55 pm

So this is the feedback for all the people who didn't made it to the second round, in no particular order.
Thanks for your efforts and the hard work!

Sorry if I didn't go into detail for everyone, but it was soo much! :whiteflag:
If I forgot someone, please write me!

EchoOread
- really like the acoustic guitar sounds, but would've like the picked guitar panned and the solo no.
- verses are rather good
- the balance in the chorus needs a bit more work. Strummed guitar and slide guitar too dominant, lead vocals get buried. More use of the stereo field.
- vocals feel somewhat detached from the rest, also sound somewhat nasal. And for whatever reason, creepy (???)
- vocals might need more compression/leveling, feel too uneven
- else: rather close call!


ungifted
- like the vocal sound, apart from some harshness.
- level balance is OK, but frequency wise seems a bit uneven, overall rather harsh and boomy.
- main acoustic needs cleanup in the bass and lower mids.
- acoustic solo though needs more substance, too thin and quite
- strummed acoustic too metallic, also i think should be panned more.

tbase2000
- I think this mix actually could've used more reverb/room :)
- maybe a bit too bass-heavy under 100Hz
- I don‘t know if putting the acoustic guitar dead center is the best idea. Overall it seems a too center-heavy.


SRMIX
- i like that I can hear Christine's bg vocals!
- the acoustic lead is way too quiet!
- i find the delay on the lead vocals too obvious, it supports the honkiness in my voice which I don't like
- can it be that the picked/strummed acoustics is compressed too much or with wrong release times? Sounds weird.
- piano and bass fight the lower frequencies, too much buildup at ~250Hz

pussylover
- i like the vocal sound (apart from the reverb) and the slide guitar sound.
- overall way too much reverb for my taste, and too long/obvious.
- electric guitars very much overshadow the vocals in the chorus. Quieter and more panning would be an option.
- shakers too loud
- not a fan of the artificial doubling of the acoustic guitar

martman22
- i like how the bass and piano give a nice foundation
- solo acoustic is way too thin!
- there is something weird happening with the lead vocals at times, there is some really honky resonance here and there. Phase problems?
- lead vocals also could use some de-harshing (3kHz?). also, sound very detached from the rest.
- I would make the shaker much more quiet and in the background.
- what happens with the bass in the last verse? Suddenly very thin!
- overall a bit too harsh.

mc37
- i think the overall level balance is OK, but the strummed acoustic is too loud
- it just sounds very boomy and boxy overall. I tried some quick EQ on the mix (200 and 600Hz and a hi shelf at ~10KHz) and it cleared it up quite a bit. From my experience especially acoustic guitars need a lot of clean up in the bass and low mid region.
- very center-heavy, especially the chorus could use more width, use the whole stereo stage there, try panning some of the guitars hard left and right

jonssinmusikii
I am sorry, but there is something seriously wrong here. The tracks must be severely misaligned – the lead vocals are way too early. The whole timing is completely off.
The acoustic guitars sound like they were encoded with 64kbps, there are glitches and artifacts.
Also it sounds as if there is a serious low cut on every track. Can it be that your listening environment has a problem?

Arthur Labus
- overall level balance is good,
- vocals generally ok, but too thin and harsh, maybe les 2-3k?
- bass too loud, heavy
- way too much modulation on everything.
- electric guitar overshadows vocals a bit
- not really happy with the mutes/arranging changes.
- overall your mix approach is valid, but just not my taste and my idea of this song, sorry :(

CoiledEar
- chorus sounds very powerful, like that.
- tambourine too loud and too much hi end
- piano gets masked by the electric guitar and sounds somewhat like an M1 piano – too artificial and hard
- slide guitar a tiny tiny bit quieter
- I‘d like to hear more of Christine‘s background vocals :)
- overall I'd preferred a more natural approach

RotterN
- like the picked acoustic guitar sound
- too much effects (doubler?) on the lead vocals, sounds unnatural
- lead vocals rather vanish in the chorus.
- overall easier on the effects
- the shakers do not need to be as loud

erictracks
- piano and ac guitar are good, like the background vocals.
- vocals too buried in reverb and too much in the background. Pretty much everything else seems louder.
- bass too loud and boomy, too much lo end
- i tried a -3db low shelf at 100Hz and a -2db cut at ~240Hz and I felt it cleaned up the muddiness a bit.
- sorry, the repeated „radio style“ vocal at the end of the last chorus is a no go. Too gimmicky. The omission there was on purpose!

shoma
- overall level balance is good.
- the slide guitar actually sounds good :)
- the lead vocals sound somewhat distorted to me.
- piano especially in the interlude sounds too processed to me.
- overall EQ balance is too harsh and lacks „warmth“, and by this i mean less high mids (2-4kHz?) and more low mids. I tried a heavy wide Q cut at 1.8kHz and a wide boost at ~150Hz and the result seemed much more pleasing.

Wizzo
- I like the picked and solo acoustic sound and the bass
- overall level balance feels good to me, but a little less level for the shakers and the Strat and the Slide
- vocals too harsh and slightly thin, too much in the ~8k area?
- really not a fan of the vocal line repeats, doesn't fit the rather natural vibe of the song.

FixInTheMix
- overall good balance.
- like the picked acoustic sound.
- strummed guitar in chorus too dominant. I think it needs separate processing from the picked parts (hi end eq?)
- acoustic lead: I would prefer it more centered
- bg vocals are pretty strong left, but not right. Feels a bit unbalanced.
- lead vocals tend to be a bit buried esp. in the chorus.


MFTWC
- I like the panning and overall balance, nice AcousticGuitar
- biggest problem; the bass is way too dominant especially compared to the vocals
- like the lead vocal sound, but should be more up front especially in the chorus, and it feels a little bit too detached. maybe a bit more reverb?
- AguitarSolo is a tiny bit too thin and I prefer it centered
- overall too boomy in the low end.

B4Lasers
- like picked acoustic guitar sound, vocal sound and female bg vocals, powerful chorus.
- solo acoustic to quiet in comparison and the delay i do not like
- piano a bit thin.
- last verse bg vocals a bit quieter.

fese
Posts: 51
Joined: Mon Apr 03, 2017 7:09 pm
Location: Bonn

Re: MIX CHALLENGE - MC37 October 2017 - Round 1 in evaluation

Post by fese » Tue Oct 24, 2017 6:58 pm

This is the feedback for all those that made it into round two.

HerbFelho
- nice acoustic lead, piano, bg vocals, level balance and instrument separation is good.
- sorry, really not a fan of the sudden doubled strummed acoustic, sounds too unnatural. It would‘ve been a nice idea for the arrangement, maybe if recorded with a 12string.
- the bass sounds too much like a Stingray to me, too much like a rock bass with the hi end slide sounds. I‘d prefer it rounder and warmer.
- strummed Acoustic sounds too metallic.
- overall maybe too much hi mids and highs in the mix, seems too cold and bright to me, especially lead vocals and AcousticGuitar. Try to go for a warmer, rounder sound.



DodgingRain
- there‘s still a bit of a honkiness/hollowness in my voice which I don‘t like that much
- electric guitars: i feel that they overshadow the vocals at times, maybe a bit more panned?
- I‘d like to hear more of the female bg vocs especially in the second and last chorus
- there is something going on in the final chorus with the EGuitarChorus2, somehow you made it sound like a cheesy Mellotron choir, and that irritates me a lot.


OoF
- level and frequency balance seem good to me.
- main acoustic more panned
- AGuitarSolo a bit too piercing in the hi end
- as are the tambourine and shaker, more to the background.
- there is something in the lead vocals which bugs me, but I am not sure what. Maybe less 200-300Hz? A bit boomy?

VasDim
- like the bass sound, and the bg vocals
- i think you could reduce harshness in the vocals (3k-ish?). Else, sounds good.
- shakers/tambourine don‘t need to be that loud. More to the background. The tambourine feels very isolated, as if there is no room, i would prefer it centered and in the back.
- the Strat and slide in the chorus is a bit too loud
- lead vocals less reverb, and/or shorter reverb
- acoustic solo too thin/hollow

Zsolt
- good balance, I like the acoustic guitar sounds and that I can hear the female bg vocals.
- lead vocals too much audible delay and reverb
- piano sounds a bit too hard, not much
- is there some delay on the ac solo guitar? Or the reflections from the reverb? A bit too much for me. Else, love the sound.
- I'd like the female bg vocals a bit more panned.
- EGuitarChorus2 maybe a bit too obtrusive.

KevinGobin
- Very bold and unconventional mix, but i quite like the intimacy of it. Vocals sound great. That being said, i feel it is a bit overdone
- bass is way too dominant.
- acoustic guitars too thin and quiet especially in the beginning. Try to preserve more of the natural sound of them.
- piano vanishes too much.
- EGuitarChorus2 has some heavy panned delay that feels too much like an autopan gimmick.
Can you tell me how you EQed my vocals?

photonic
- weird flangy effect on the acoustic lead. not to my liking. also seems to be compressed to hard especially in the interlude the attack come off too hard. Also I think you EQed the „warmth“ from the sound.
- please less chorus on the Strat
- the strummed acoustic in the chorus needs taming, too dominant
- shakers a bit quieter
- else not much to complain.

DaveMcIsaac
- lead vocals feels a bit too detached from the music
- chorus: electric guitars to loud, more of the female bg vocals
- laste verse: less of my bg vocals
- acoustic lead a little bit too loud
Last edited by fese on Tue Oct 24, 2017 7:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.

fese
Posts: 51
Joined: Mon Apr 03, 2017 7:09 pm
Location: Bonn

Re: MIX CHALLENGE - MC37 October 2017 - Round 1 in evaluation

Post by fese » Tue Oct 24, 2017 7:14 pm

General guidelines for round two

While listening to all your mixes (and also realizing what is wrong with my mix!), there are some things that are now clearer to me or that I think need extra attention:
  • the strummed acoustic guitar in the chorus is really problematic (I am not good at strumming and maybe should've used a pick instead of fingernails:). Maybe it should be split into a separate track for EQ and compression. Often it sounds good in the verses, but in the chorus it is too metallic, to heavy in the high mids. It shouldn't be too dominant.
  • Chorus: even if my whole song would've fit on a 24track tape, there is a lot happening here and it seems like it is not that easy to mix.
    I think the main focus should be on the lead vocals and the (female) background vocals, I want those to be the center of attention. Everything else is more or less texture.
  • the percussive elements should be rather subtle and are only there to give the song a tiny bit more drive towards the end. They should not stick out. Tambourine should be in the center.
  • Please do not thin out the acoustic guitar too much, especially the solo parts or the intro. If necessary, automate the EQ when all the other instruments set in and need space.
  • not a fan of the acoustic solo guitar panned left or right.
  • but I prefer the picked/strummed acoustic a bit panned.
  • the electric guitars I think are best panned
  • overall strive for a round and warm (yes, I said it :hihi: ) sound. Call it vintage, if you like. Not too bright and modern.

Mork
Posts: 86
Joined: Fri Apr 14, 2017 9:55 pm
Location: Hamburg

Re: MIX CHALLENGE - MC37 October 2017 - Round 1 in evaluation

Post by Mork » Tue Oct 24, 2017 7:21 pm

Noooo! :o

Seems like my submission got lost in the black hole of the interwebs! I submitted it half an hour before deadline, at least I thought I did. Oh well, I'll post it over in the "Idiots that can't meat a deadline" section. :face:
Okay, I admit, I just wanted to keep your workload down, fese! :P

Cheers
Mork

edit: Can't seem to find the "after deadline" section. Is it gone or am I really that stupid? :roll:
So here's the link anyways: https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B9f_r ... UI3amktam8
Would love to get some feedback so please, Fox, HELP! Where do I put this? :help:

fese
Posts: 51
Joined: Mon Apr 03, 2017 7:09 pm
Location: Bonn

Re: MIX CHALLENGE - MC37 October 2017 - Round 1 in evaluation

Post by fese » Tue Oct 24, 2017 8:15 pm

Mork wrote:
Tue Oct 24, 2017 7:21 pm
Noooo! :o

Seems like my submission got lost in the black hole of the interwebs! I submitted it half an hour before deadline, at least I thought I did. Oh well, I'll post it over in the "Idiots that can't meat a deadline" section. :face:
Okay, I admit, I just wanted to keep your workload down, fese! :P

Cheers
Mork

edit: Can't seem to find the "after deadline" section. Is it gone or am I really that stupid? :roll:
So here's the link anyways: https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B9f_r ... UI3amktam8
Would love to get some feedback so please, Fox, HELP! Where do I put this? :help:
Well, this is really too bad, because your mix would've been a really strong contender :sad: Seems like you got where I was heading with my mix, just made it better. I really dig it. Maybe the female bg vocals in the chorus a slightly more audible and the strummed guitar a teeny tiny bit quieter.
I really would like to see some of your EQ settings (acoustic guitars and vocals)!

kc23
Posts: 39
Joined: Thu Aug 03, 2017 11:03 pm

Re: MIX CHALLENGE - MC37 October 2017 - Round 1 in evaluation

Post by kc23 » Tue Oct 24, 2017 8:19 pm

fese wrote:
Tue Oct 24, 2017 6:55 pm
So this is the feedback for all the people who didn't made it to the second round, in no particular order.
Thanks for your efforts and the hard work!



mc37
- i think the overall level balance is OK, but the strummed acoustic is too loud
- it just sounds very boomy and boxy overall. I tried some quick EQ on the mix (200 and 600Hz and a hi shelf at ~10KHz) and it cleared it up quite a bit. From my experience especially acoustic guitars need a lot of clean up in the bass and low mid region.
- very center-heavy, especially the chorus could use more width, use the whole stereo stage there, try panning some of the guitars hard left and right
So... I think this one must be me... right? :hihi:

If so, I´m guessing you tried cutting 200 and 600 and boosting that shelf@10k?

I remember cutting a lot of 600 across almost all tracks... 200 not so much!

could you tell me how hard was that shelf boost?


thanks!

fese
Posts: 51
Joined: Mon Apr 03, 2017 7:09 pm
Location: Bonn

Re: MIX CHALLENGE - MC37 October 2017 - Round 1 in evaluation

Post by fese » Tue Oct 24, 2017 9:18 pm

kc23 wrote:
Tue Oct 24, 2017 8:19 pm
fese wrote:
Tue Oct 24, 2017 6:55 pm
mc37
So... I think this one must be me... right? :hihi:
Argh... brainfart :lol:
kc23 wrote:
Tue Oct 24, 2017 8:19 pm
If so, I´m guessing you tried cutting 200 and 600 and boosting that shelf@10k?

I remember cutting a lot of 600 across almost all tracks... 200 not so much!

could you tell me how hard was that shelf boost?
not much, 2dB or so. It was all just a quick try, don't take my word for it... But I know from experience that acoustics usually have strong resonances at ~200Hz-300Hz area and I tend to cut quite a bit.

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Mister Fox
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Re: MIX CHALLENGE - MC37 October 2017 - Mix Round 2 until 29-10-2017 11:59pm GMT+1/CET

Post by Mister Fox » Tue Oct 24, 2017 10:25 pm

Thank you for handling the evaluation, fese. Now that went definitely faster than expected.

Let us kick off Mix Round 2, which will end on Sunday, 29-OCT-2017 11:59pm GMT+1/CET
IMPORTANT INFORMATION: Europe has the Daylight Saving Time switch on this weekend.


There is a GLOBAL COUNTDOWN available to check for deadlines.
Just follow this link: Global Countdown (on homepage)



The following 8 participants go into Round 2 (alphabetical order)

DaveMcIsaac
DodgingRain
HerbFelho
KevinGobin
Octupus on Fire (OoF)
photonic
VasDim
Zsolt


A thank you to everyone, and good luck for Round 2

shoma
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Location: NRW, Germany
Contact:

Re: MIX CHALLENGE - MC37 October 2017 - Round 1 in evaluation

Post by shoma » Tue Oct 24, 2017 10:55 pm

fese wrote:
Tue Oct 24, 2017 6:55 pm




shoma
- overall level balance is good.
- the slide guitar actually sounds good :)
- the lead vocals sound somewhat distorted to me.
- piano especially in the interlude sounds too processed to me.
- overall EQ balance is too harsh and lacks „warmth“, and by this i mean less high mids (2-4kHz?) and more low mids. I tried a heavy wide Q cut at 1.8kHz and a wide boost at ~150Hz and the result seemed much more pleasing.


Thanks for listening and your honest opinion! :smile:

Distortion on the lead vocal? Hm, I'll have a look into this. Although I can't imagine, what is distorting there. Maybe a bit too heavy in Slates Virtual Tube Buss (Hollywood...which gives extra warmth instead of harshness..at least it should :grin: )

The piano does not have a lot of processing. fx-wise there is a just little room with Eventide Tverb and Ozone Imager (just for positioning). I guess, it's too much of the warm mids eq'ed out, so that the artficial high end of the piano-samples came too much upfront...I'll see, if I can fix this :-)

"overall EQ balance is too harsh and lacks „warmth“" Well, yes...that's my way of mixing. :-D I was told, this way it's easier for mastering, when a mix is balanced in itself, but lacks warmth or has too much presence. But that could've been be fixed easily for round 2 :tu:

Edit: no need to fix anything, because...I obviously don't have to :-D

Good Luck to everyone else in round 2! :tu: :hyper:

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Arthur Labus
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Location: Aachen, Germany

Re: MIX CHALLENGE - MC37 October 2017 - Mix Round 2 until 29-10-2017 11:59pm GMT+1/CET

Post by Arthur Labus » Tue Oct 24, 2017 11:43 pm

Thanks fese for detailed feedback.
Well, no risk - no fun and i had fun ;)

All the best for round 2 !

PS: Could i post my mix as part of my portfolio on Soundcloud ?

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