Mix Challenge

Posted: **Thu Sep 21, 2023 12:51 CEST**

Thanks for the feedback Gaz !

Posted: **Thu Sep 21, 2023 13:59 CEST**

Hey @SDB_12,

all of this is very subjective of course, but a few thoughts.

Apart from the obvious mishap, I think your mix is not bad at all.
I like the ambience on the lead and modulation on background vocals.
My initial approach was definitely too dry in that regard.

Balances are good, imo, but background vocals should be a bit louder.
Maybe pull the intro sounds up a notch. They can give an indication to the listener to adjust their playback volume where you want it, before the song kicks off (at least that's how I saw it).

I would dial the vocal compression back a bit. Use more automation to help tell the story.
The radio voice isn't really there, you should mute the clean lead or do some extra processing.
Organ in the battle scene is way over-distorted for my taste.

The pitch "correction" is absolutely horrible, hahaha. Blimey.
Always give it a few proper listens-through before you submit anything, friends or clients.
It could absolutely ruin your reputation (and maybe it should, because it comes off as disregard for the clients work).

With complex projects like these, it's very likely to miss something. I had to correct my mix a few times.

Better luck next time, Hals- und Beinbruch to the second rounders.

Cheers

Posted: **Thu Sep 21, 2023 18:34 CEST**

@SDB_12 Hi there made i just listen you are mix and i will share my humble opinion which is very wordy and doesn't matter of course

So i like the mix in general only some things bugd my ears -I miss drums in some places and they are a bit muddy at least for me.Vocals are good but when u make them bright u must care more for the "S" 'K" "Sh" "Ch" and so on.At one place i hear wrong note witch means that u are using some kinda of a pitch correction and it not tune to the correct note.For the lead guitar its to far away in the mix may be less revurb or even non at all.Thats all

Posted: **Sat Sep 23, 2023 00:38 CEST**

scottfitz wrote: ↑
Mon Sep 18, 2023 02:51 CEST
...

Hope this helps and good luck going forward

Hey Scottfitz!

I really appreciate you giving me an honest and through review on my mix. I sent you a PM because I didn't want to distract the contest discussions.

And congrats to everyone who was selected for Round 2! Best of luck to all!

Gaz thanks for letting us mix such an interesting and engaging song! I really really dig the concept surrounding the lyrics that you posted about and the deep meaning!

Posted: **Sat Sep 23, 2023 08:05 CEST**

I am more than overjoyed to announce the following license sponsor for the Mix Challenge audio community

Acon Digital is kind enough to give away either one plugin bundle, or any individual stereo plug-in of winner's choice. (exception: Application Bundles, Immersive plugins)
License will turn into NFR
More info on Acon Digital: https://acondigital.com

Acon Digital have been with Mix Challenge since December 2014. They renew their partnership for the Mix(ing) Challenge with offering licenses to nearly all available plug-in products. Their offer is retroactive (starting with MC093 / August 2023).

A huge thank you goes to Acon Digital for providing the licenses.

Posted: **Sat Sep 23, 2023 15:21 CEST**

scottfitz wrote: ↑
Tue Aug 22, 2023 23:23 CEST
You are nicer about my mix than I am! I wouldn't want to list everything that I know Is wrong with it

However ,I'm interested to know what does "Dept" mean?

In response to your other comments, the guitar I placed down a bit because I wanted the rhythm to be the main thing at that point. The lead vocal I thought was ok personally but I accept if you want more. When you say opened up, do you mean less compression? Or perhaps you mean less interference from frequencies around it? Or perhaps you mean more top end frequencies ?

Thanks v much for your feedback.

Hi @scottfitz

Congratulation going to round 2. Sorry that I did not see your question before. Anyway, hope this clear things out.

Our ears are fantastic. We can hear a sound and what direction it is coming from and most of the time, the distance to the sound source. This goes for music as well. Think of being at a concert with a band. You will hear the direction to the instruments(panning) and in most cases the different distance(dept) to the instruments as well. I'm an oldtimer, doing a lot of FOH jobs in the 70's. Back then "dept" was an important issue. You'll hear a lot of "dept" in the recordings from that period as well. Bruce Swedien, the engineer that made the records for Michael Jackson+++ was very clear on this topic: Music is left, right AND "DEPT". It's important to distinguish reverb from "dept". Often you can hear a lot of reverb, but the mix is still "flat". With "flat" I mean that the mix is 'between your ears' if you listen to the mix in HP. If it's "dept" in the mix you'll experience that eg a guitar is in front of you and the drums are behind the guitar.

In the 90's we got MP3 that striped out some of the high freq and compressed the file. This reduced the "dept" and the the "life" in the mix. After that the loudness war started and the use of compressors and limiters was used massively to get the loudest mix. Compressors are the main "dept" killer if used wrongly, so by then the "dept" was dead. At a moment someone start to "glue" their mix with masterbus compression. If "gluing" the mix you got "sticky glue" but you also probably kill the "dept", lose "air", "space" and "separation"

I always mix in the way that I pretend to "being there", meaning I'm sitting in the audience listening. So I do not "glue" the mix and I trying placing the musicians in a 3D "landscape" and preserve the "dept" and "life" in the music.

Listen to the original mix(not remastered) in high quality of Michael Jackson "Thriller" mixed by Bruce Swedien(https://music.youtube.com/watch?v=Z85lx ... Q31-Yq2T8f). You'll hear the "Dept" clearly even on studio monitors. The interesting thing is that this track is made only with a tiny bit of compression on Michael's vocal.

So whats my rule of thumbs to achieve "dept":

1. Avoid using compressors in the signal path if possible
2. Preserve transients, if compressing
3. Use parallel compression instead or by it selves to enhance the transients, make more clarity or moving the sound source back and forth in the mix.
4. Use reverb and predelay to make "dept"
5. Send sound sources to the same reverb, even if it's nearly inaudible. It makes our ear put them in the same "room"
6. Do not "glue" the mix
7. I also use a technic to open up the mix and enhance the "Dept" that's already there
These are of course not strict rules.

Hope this explain what "Dept" is and some other aspect of mixing history.

Steinar :-)

Posted: **Sat Sep 23, 2023 19:44 CEST**

Thanks @Gaz for liking my mix

Here are the changes for round two:
1. Added a tremolo to the bass track in the jazzy section, added some distortion in the crazy part
2. Pushed the organ, pulled down the piano
3. Pushed the BVs to get a better blend with the LV in the last part
4. Pushed the Acoustic Guitars a little bit and panned them wider
5. The snare seemed to be a bit dull to me so I added a hair of Drumforge DF-XCITE to get more sparkle. Pushed the Drums in the Intro a bit.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/8rc0d5j26s4tp ... 2.wav?dl=0

Posted: **Sun Sep 24, 2023 06:24 CEST**

Christoph_K wrote: ↑
Sat Sep 23, 2023 19:44 CEST
Thanks @Gaz for liking my mix

Here are the changes for round two:
1. Added a tremolo to the bass track in the jazzy section, added some distortion in the crazy part
2. Pushed the organ, pulled down the piano
3. Pushed the BVs to get a better blend with the LV in the last part
4. Pushed the Acoustic Guitars a little bit and panned them wider
5. The snare seemed to be a bit dull to me so I added a hair of Drumforge DF-XCITE to get more sparkle. Pushed the Drums in the Intro a bit.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/8rc0d5j26s4tp ... 2.wav?dl=0

Well done, this is brilliant

Posted: **Sun Sep 24, 2023 10:29 CEST**

sthauge wrote: ↑
Sat Sep 23, 2023 15:21 CEST

scottfitz wrote: ↑
Tue Aug 22, 2023 23:23 CEST
You are nicer about my mix than I am! I wouldn't want to list everything that I know Is wrong with it

However ,I'm interested to know what does "Dept" mean?

In response to your other comments, the guitar I placed down a bit because I wanted the rhythm to be the main thing at that point. The lead vocal I thought was ok personally but I accept if you want more. When you say opened up, do you mean less compression? Or perhaps you mean less interference from frequencies around it? Or perhaps you mean more top end frequencies ?

Thanks v much for your feedback.
Hi @scottfitz

Congratulation going to round 2. Sorry that I did not see your question before. Anyway, hope this clear things out.

Our ears are fantastic. We can hear a sound and what direction it is coming from and most of the time, the distance to the sound source. This goes for music as well. Think of being at a concert with a band. You will hear the direction to the instruments(panning) and in most cases the different distance(dept) to the instruments as well. I'm an oldtimer, doing a lot of FOH jobs in the 70's. Back then "dept" was an important issue. You'll hear a lot of "dept" in the recordings from that period as well. Bruce Swedien, the engineer that made the records for Michael Jackson+++ was very clear on this topic: Music is left, right AND "DEPT". It's important to distinguish reverb from "dept". Often you can hear a lot of reverb, but the mix is still "flat". With "flat" I mean that the mix is 'between your ears' if you listen to the mix in HP. If it's "dept" in the mix you'll experience that eg a guitar is in front of you and the drums are behind the guitar.

In the 90's we got MP3 that striped out some of the high freq and compressed the file. This reduced the "dept" and the the "life" in the mix. After that the loudness war started and the use of compressors and limiters was used massively to get the loudest mix. Compressors are the main "dept" killer if used wrongly, so by then the "dept" was dead. At a moment someone start to "glue" their mix with masterbus compression. If "gluing" the mix you got "sticky glue" but you also probably kill the "dept", lose "air", "space" and "separation"

I always mix in the way that I pretend to "being there", meaning I'm sitting in the audience listening. So I do not "glue" the mix and I trying placing the musicians in a 3D "landscape" and preserve the "dept" and "life" in the music.

Listen to the original mix(not remastered) in high quality of Michael Jackson "Thriller" mixed by Bruce Swedien(https://music.youtube.com/watch?v=Z85lx ... Q31-Yq2T8f). You'll hear the "Dept" clearly even on studio monitors. The interesting thing is that this track is made only with a tiny bit of compression on Michael's vocal.

So whats my rule of thumbs to achieve "dept":

1. Avoid using compressors in the signal path if possible
2. Preserve transients, if compressing
3. Use parallel compression instead or by it selves to enhance the transients, make more clarity or moving the sound source back and forth in the mix.
4. Use reverb and predelay to make "dept"
5. Send sound sources to the same reverb, even if it's nearly inaudible. It makes our ear put them in the same "room"
6. Do not "glue" the mix
7. I also use a technic to open up the mix and enhance the "Dept" that's already there
These are of course not strict rules.

Hope this explain what "Dept" is and some other aspect of mixing history.

Steinar :-)

Thanks so much Steinar, I think you might just be BANG ON! I've looked into Bruce Swedien and I'm definitely losing my way on the preservation of transients. It's been a bit of a journey for me trying to work with a Brauer template. I would think if Bruce was still with us he may not see be quite eye to eye with Michael Brauer. One says don't use compression much at all, the other says put everything through a complex web of compressors.

On this round 2 mix I've struggled with COVID totally wrecking my hearing, but I'll definitely be putting more of the transients through for you which ought to help with the 'dept'.

Thanks again, great feedback for me, that's has helped me no end.

Posted: **Sun Sep 24, 2023 18:57 CEST**

Nice jobs everybody!
Some are outstanding.

Client rulez!
Collecting hints and clues by Gaz here and there and pushing them to the limits. My limits

Besides the list of to-do's and solutions, I've been working for clarity with eq separation.

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/sl0bjt9g ... ydbw3&dl=0

Cheers.

Mix Challenge

MIX CHALLENGE - MC093 August 2023 - Winners announced

Re: MIX CHALLENGE - MC093 August 2023 - Mix Round 2 until until 25-SEP-2023 23:59 UTC+2/CEST

Re: MIX CHALLENGE - MC093 August 2023 - Mix Round 2 until until 25-SEP-2023 23:59 UTC+2/CEST

Re: MIX CHALLENGE - MC093 August 2023 - Mix Round 2 until until 25-SEP-2023 23:59 UTC+2/CEST

Re: MIX CHALLENGE - MC093 August 2023 - Mix Round 1 in evaluation

MIX CHALLENGE - MC093 August 2023 - Mix Round 2 until until 25-SEP-2023 23:59 UTC+2/CEST

Re: MIX CHALLENGE - MC093 August 2023 - Submissions extended until 24-AUG-2023 23:59 UTC+2/CEST

Re: MIX CHALLENGE - MC093 August 2023 - Mix Round 2 until until 25-SEP-2023 23:59 UTC+2/CEST

Re: MIX CHALLENGE - MC093 August 2023 - Mix Round 2 until until 25-SEP-2023 23:59 UTC+2/CEST

Re: MIX CHALLENGE - MC093 August 2023 - Submissions extended until 24-AUG-2023 23:59 UTC+2/CEST

Re: MIX CHALLENGE - MC093 August 2023 - Mix Round 2 until until 25-SEP-2023 23:59 UTC+2/CEST