Mix Challenge

Los_ady wrote: ↑

Thu Nov 19, 2020 12:45 CET

So here we go, first of all, I received a funny message that my mix & some others would be considered in "the top music producer" World to be "Bedroom Producer quality" and I want to share one more, last lesson here:

I know the big world of top class producers and there is a lot of Ego, often just waiting to give someone else the final judgement of "this person is a bedroom producer" haha

Those comments and search for self-confirmation that "I am better than this amateur" can be traced back to unresolved issues that can be solved & discovered with meditation & connecting to your inner centre.

The beauty of music is its versatility & creativity and we should not forget that we, as the producer, serve the artist and are there to enhance their musical vision, not ours, in a professional quality.

And this is my tip:

The beauty is that I accepted that we all have a ego, not getting rid of it - just get it out of my own way

I'm not doing this job to "be the best" among other producers because I don't need this confirmation: I decide about my happiness, my sadness and don't live a life that is ruled by the judgement of others - and this lifestyle liberates my mind and keeps me open minded for my work as a producer.

My reward are happy & returning artists and to make a positive contribution in this world.

Very interesting and nice speech!

I'm primarily a musician but also earned money with mixing of recordings. And I noticed that the problem with the 'ego' and especially narcisstic humiliation seems to be present more among producers than among musicians. Independent of the level.
And I don't exempt myself from that! But I learned in the last years that I better do what I love rather than compare myself with others too much ...
Because it's all about art and expression of emotions. Also with producing ... the producer is the 'interface' between the artist and the consumer, so of course he always does an artistic job.

And I definitely haven't the best start-conditions for my career and entire life, by the way. So of course I also could whine ... but exactly this leads to what you mentioned above ...

Los_ady wrote: ↑

Thu Nov 19, 2020 12:45 CET

@m_tree

Everything great, especially the small details like the automated kick punching in the chest when it comes to the guitar bridge
Bass is a bit too cloudy and the backing vocals are too loud
Before second verse volume drop, a bit too much
The Low end have to be tighter, clean and defined

Thanks! To which mix (e.g. R2) relates this?
It's really interesting ... e.g. I didn't automate the kick by itself and I added some low-end to the bass (not with EQ) because I made the experience that a lot of bands want more low-end than the original bass-tracks of this multitrack have ... and so on. But I think this wouldn't be constructive anymore.

Thanks again for the opportunity and the feedback!

Totally agree @m_tree !

Yeah it is, I think nobody had a "perfect" start because perfection does not exist - it's often another word for saying:"I am not enough"

Anyway, this feedback is for R2 and it popped out after we compared it with the other 10 tracks but we all know the truth: We just had to find SOMETHING to complain about

Jokin' as mentioned above, all mixes were great, the Band had the most influence on the final, winning Mix

min 3:14 - 3:16 something strange is happening

Not exactly sure what I was thinking here haha, I probably wanted to emphasize the drum room at this point.
I thought I had too much reverb on in general.

Really cool to see the different approaches, and I learnt a lot more the genre.

Cheers,

@dnlptn haha I thought to find other words about it

I think we got the intention and I actually liked the idea, it went really heavy, like a drop almost!

Btw Annia really liked your mix!

Hi all,
the Challenge is over. Because Ady and the band liked to get a link on soundcloud of my version, i made an optimized rough mastered version for soundcloud. If someone like to listen:
https://soundcloud.com/user-431132627/c ... oughmaster

Cheers
Tom

Hello Tom,
I listened into this, man you are quite loud haha..
as always, the final compression and limiting can change a lot.
some issues that I happen to be picky with, are coming back.
the "plastic" sounding snare (transient in the top mic) -
some metallic sounds and some glitches in the guitar -
the notorious hihat bleed -
anyway, a winning mix for the podium.

As known, I did something different, though psychedelic as well, but rounder. (as I hope)
This is a "secret link", so it can only be found in this thread:
https://soundcloud.com/xsq9t33igh6h/mc7 ... Wl2IFTdcYw
My purpose was to sound a bit 70ies vinyl-ish, which was not the loudest era, and dynamics were very restricted, which shaped many productions, and I love the old stuff the way it is.
I used a very simple limiter, the free SN05G because it sounds very transparent as long we don't slam it too much.
But I hope it fits well in some play lists.
Professional mastering sure would achieve a lot more.

@Los_ady , are you still out there?
In case you don't agree with it, I will reset the link.
You can't be a bedroom producer, when you are a cruising van producer!
*greetings*

Hahaha @White Punk OD that's true

Yes I'm there but deep in my mixing cave, just finished 3 mixes yesterday and got a Full Album at the moment + a lot of other stuff going on

Preparing a new Podcast where I interview people from the Music Business to explain their Role: Mixing Engineer, A&R, Label Owner, Indi Label Owner (both kinds, real independents & Independents that are under Major Labels) and so on and so on so stay tuned for more

Man - I didn't came back to your questions last time, sorry man!

Yeah there is a lot of bleed in the Snare from the HiHat

Again what happened here is that I actually muted couple of the 16 mic's, the snare was super tricky because of the bleed.

Vocals were recorded pretty sharp, I used a Tube Mic that emphasised the Top End (Pretty Bad move as Annia have already a very bright voice, we all learn with time haha)

That's why it's important to not just sit and learn via YouTube but going out there and just trying it haha that's how I could learn!

I think they are right with "bedroom Producer" though I was rather mixing in the kitchen

The question is:Should I not produce and hide because I don't have a Studio or just trying it? You decide

Anyway, do you have any more questions to the recording process????

Hey @White Punk OD I also listened to your Mix, keep it there where it is

White Punk OD wrote: ↑

Fri Nov 27, 2020 13:19 CET

Hello Tom,
I listened into this, man you are quite loud haha..

Hy White Punk,
thanks for listening. Well, this was a quick master for soundcloud, or let's call it an optimized version. i really have a lot of respect for anyone who can create professional masterings. I would never imagine I can do this.
That's why i also provided an unmastered version on soundcloud (it's quite the same as my original version, without some vocal glitches, hiss etc.).
https://soundcloud.com/user-431132627/c ... ed-mixdown
What i realized is that SC adds some addional dynamic changes to the track, it sounds more compressed.

of course i listened to you SC track, too. to be honest, I also liked your original version from the contest more ;-). I started listening to music in the 70s, but loved the sounds of the 80s more. There was such a new sound aesthetic in this decade that really fascinated me. I often like it dirty too, but I admire everyone who can make it sound dirty, snotty and still powerful and a kind of transparent ;-)

Cheers,
Tom

Thx so much for your comments both!

Ady, what skins did the drum set have? I guess it was not exactly the "Deep Purple" type oil skins? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2M7jVY_MM5Q

I would like to know, who used modern "hitech" plugins, like Gullfoss, iZotope Intensity, DSM V3 (the Paul Frindle spectral comp), Neutron "unmasking" guide, etc. ?

Tech hint:
Who noticed the reverse pumping, that is going on under the carpet most of the time? This is the mpressor on the drum room bus, with ratio around negative .5 and some parallel routing, and using the rare "GR Limit" knob to not lose signal outside of that effect.

At that point it seems to become really difficult, there is always a trade-off, and things become very hard to define, the "sweet/powerful spot" often cannot be explained - why is a version better, and how many (if we had a Motown test audience as it was in the ancient times) at all would have this opinion?
Should we just ride the master fader for more dynamics?

Most practise mixes I did, the tracks enforced a certain arrangement, the arrangement enforced certain dynamics, I had to regulate it just a bit so the compressors did not puke or overload, and soon this aspect of the mix was completed.
This time, it did not happen, but I was focused on shifting the sound towards something I used to like. But it seems, that now after I tried out what I wanted, it sounds a bit too "Pop" and shallow.
With my top 11 entry, sadly I had a recall problem, after Windows Update suddenly forced a reboot. I really have no clue what has changed. I was experimenting, so with a paid project I would avoid some plugins, and use a different strategy in version control.

What is your opinion or take on different listening levels, seen from the public?
Like, in the car, dynamics have to be very limited, because of the engine and street noises. The spectrum cannot exceed a certain balance, else it would totally hurt, when we turn the radio louder, or the woofer would crash. Similar things happen in a pub. And too much of mid-range would disturb the people who are drinking and talking.
Also in the headphones, when I crank it up, many of the brighter mixes really start to hurt. Or, at lower levels, density is too sparse, some warmth is missing, it sounds a bit incomplete.
Regarding these aspects, I thought my mixes were not too bad.

Especially the vocals, they must carry the sound a 100 percent, and must sound very dark, the way I feel this song. Not sure whether Annia can recognize herself in this mix though. But to the outside world, it is about the song first.

There is one more aspect, that I would like to hear about.
In short, I prefer a "shitty mix" a lot, when clarity would reveal that the band and the level of production are not yet on eye-height with let's say Evanescence, or Paramore ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvnkAtWcKYg ). Oh, wait, they even use some similar guitar sounds like at the beginning of "Decode". I should have used this one as another reference check.
So, if it sounds a bit mystic and "cassette", the audience might like the song even more, when it can trigger some fantasy and emotion. Drama baby, drama!!
I actually used the M/S mode of the Alpha comp on the master, and the Phil's Cascade saturator on the total guitar bus, to destroy "transparency".
Still I want to learn to do it in a better way, that sounds less "drunk".
But OTOH in the West, currently we have a generation that seems totally obsessed with cleanliness, pristine clarity, aesthetics of purity and hygiene, you probably know what I mean.
So I strongly digress from that direction, and I'm actually tuned to this kind of stuff as here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mVrN-j_Uc0U which is only a few weeks old, and it has the density and the round and full low end.


Fun fact: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VwriLCqtVic -- ILLUMENIUM
they are a Baltic band, probably known also in Poland, and they are also "van-nomads", always on tour, and recording locally, wherever they are.
They used to master their stuff extremely loud, but recently it seems to become softer, and they also integreate some EDM stuff.

Ady's African projects sound very genuine and reasonable, those musicians appreciate very natural and sensitiv sounds. I have been listening to regional African music since long, here are some more examples:
Coumba Gawlo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-89-sXX6Rec (watch how BPM speeds up!!), https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HeFpnYKGXMk , https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e7ZUYMOmv5s (great song, sadly broken copy)
Sona Jobarteh https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PtmmlOQnTXM (now a globalized artist)