Mix Challenge

The idea of not using sample triggering, is trying to get the most out of the given material. EQ and compression can go a long way - and there are more and more tools aimed at "percussive work" to shape the tone even more.

If you can't get a good mix out of an (in this case) very well recorded drum set to begin with, and you have to use samples, because "other modern day mixers do the same"... then something is going wrong. IMO and all that.

Mister Fox wrote: ↑

Thu Feb 22, 2018 04:24 CET

The idea of not using sample triggering, is trying to get the most out of the given material. EQ and compression can go a long way - and there are more and more tools aimed at "percussive work" to shape the tone even more.

That is exactly what I intend to do: to get the most out of any given material. Yes, EQ, dynamics, saturation and whatnot can all go a long way but if I feel that layering a sample can get me there in a much less destructive way, why bother setting up the "worlds most sophisticated fx chain" which introduces a lot of artifacts? Also the outcome will never be the same. If the sample had changed the tone of the snare too obviously the producer would have been the first one to call me out.
Also it's an important skill in your toolbox, so this site should be a good place to train that skill just as well as eqing etc., especially if we're trying to emulate the "real world". Again, I am not talking about replacing some rock drums with your hottest 808 Trap beat (as in being a co-producer), but using the samples just as an eq, reverb, glue for the mix (as in mixing a record).
My last point: What is the difference to adding a gated tonegenerator which generates a sine or pink noise, which is not forbidden (I think)?
I mean, a lot synths are generating snares through modulating (like the gate) pink noise. I could generate the snare via tonegenerator, but am forbidden to add a similar sound as a sample?

Mister Fox wrote: ↑

Thu Feb 22, 2018 04:24 CET

If you can't get a good mix out of an (in this case) very well recorded drum set to begin with, and you have to use samples, because "other modern day mixers do the same"... then something is going wrong. IMO and all that.

See above why I did it. Mentioning other mixers was just a way to underline how common a tool it is and that it does not differ from using other techniques like eqing or compressing the material. I am pretty sure you didn't just want to insult me...

I hereby plead for the allowance of sample triggering for the reasons mentioned above. The producer can always forbid it via add on rules, for whatever reasons he/she might have.
It could be somehow restricted, but I don't think it's necessary, as everyone who goes overboard and puts his own vision above that of the producers, will not be seeing round 2. That's for sure! Exactly that is part of the learning curve and I think that's why it should be part of this site.

Again, sorry for the rule violation!

Cheers
Mork

Suggestion - unless the subject is non-negotiable:

Round 1: Disallow sample triggering.
Round 2: Allow sample triggering.

I didn't insult you, Mork - I was merely stating the facts with this particular drum recording (I'm doing integrity checks after all).

You bring up a valid point with "sub harmonic content creation" - is it valid to do so, should it only be a sine wave or can it be "noise" as well? Even though it's "triggered" via a gate, it's still not samples. So should we allow it? Should we not? How far can we go with what we have already - even though it might introduce... "artifacts" (which I consider a bit of a moot point, especially with modern day tools - unless you crank the living hell out of a signal).


You will get your chance to work on a drum set with triggered samples down the road (a future Mix Challenge). However - these samples are already provided. Else, the focus is still on "make the best out of what you have" - especially if the production took attention to detail as to what drum sound has been selected (which is also part of the Integrity Check "behind the scenes" to address this). So most of the time, you will read "no drum triggering" as add-on rule.

We can discuss this further in the FAQ/Gossip thread.