SONGWRITING COMPETITION - SWC01 September 2017 - Winners announced

[donkey tugger]

Technically, DT was also one minute too late, but well... internet traffic and all.

I thought, oh..I've got an hour to upload this etc, plenty of time. Then I realised, no I haven't....

[Mister Fox]

Let us kick off the VOTING PROCESS, which will end on Sunday, 01-OCT-2017 11:59pm GMT+1/CEST latest


NEW FEATURE:
There isa new new GLOBAL COUNTDOWN to check for deadlines.
Just follow this link: Global Countdown (on homepage)



Here is the collection of productions from all participants:

'King of Ashes'

.wav
.mp3

Big Stick

Wave: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B1Rlpg ... sp=sharing
MP3: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B1Rlpg ... sp=sharing

OoF - Hearts of Stone:

wav: https://mega.nz/#!2cwQRbbD!Gster610q_yd ... P-xDU3lVk4
mp3: https://mega.nz/#!nRRUVL4D!Fhafb1BNrW4k ... fvtbstBsI8

"Burn with me"

wav
mp3

'through the night'

MP3:

phpBB [media]

http://erictracks.com/wp-content/upload ... enight.mp3

WAV:

phpBB [media]

http://erictracks.com/wp-content/upload ... enight.wav

Hyperthyroid.

.wav 44khz 32bits
https://www.dropbox.com/s/1jh2mhqq5j4lr ... d.wav?dl=0

mp3
https://www.dropbox.com/s/zh2rjaen37c56 ... d.mp3?dl=0

In Orange

http://www.bennyleeds7.myfreeola.uk/swc ... nge-v3.mp3

Please consult this post of how your vote could look like.

Good luck to all participants!

[Tbase2000]

So...when you say "This will be done in public for about 5 days max, until it's the 1st of the next month, or all contestants have cast their" does that mean we publicly post our vote list in this thread? I'm assuming that's what it means but just wanted to make sure. Feels a little weird.

[Mister Fox]

Yes... top 10 votes (or top 6 in this case, as you can't vote for yourself) are public, not via PM.

Feels weird, but I saw this working at other communities and it adds to forum interaction.

[Tbase2000]

First. I am going to listen to everyones mix as is. I'm not going to bring it into a DAW to check your
-18dbfs levels. I'm just to lazy. Do we really need that for this type of contest really? I don't know.
If your overly compressed and loud then lets just take points off you for being stupid.

Secondly I am going to listen as a fellow musician and hopefully not offend anyone with my opinions
or critiques.

Anyway. I'm going to judge you on 3 criteria. 1) Recording Quality: How good does your stuff
sound? 2) Production: What if any and how big did you go? 3) Vibe: What does it put off? How
sexy is it?

Going right down the list:

Song1) Nige King of Ashes
A) Recording Quality
1) OMG who did that bass? Phenominal.
2) Vocal is pro sounding with some nasty Shhsss here and there. Can't win them all
3) Everything is big and the mix is professional
Value: 9

B) Production:
1) Lot's of things going on. I can hear plenty of tracks with back-up vocals. Got some keys in there
to help too. I can hear a theme and a story.
Value: 9

C) Vibe:
1) Rock/Metal theme. Yes. Is it convincing? As an idea could you finish and polish it if it isn't
already? Yes
Value: 9

Total Score: 27

Song 2) Octopus Heart of Stone
A) Recording Quality
1) That bass and that intro is absolutely Sick! I waited for the vocals and just sighed when I didn't
hear them. Damnit! Drums are big, I like the key ideas but they are underproduced. You have like
4 more tracks of guitars to do to make this work. Can I get a lead please?
Total Value:9

B) Production: No vocal, rhythm track at best accept for that sick intro. No lead sigh....
Value: 6

C) Vibe:
1) That opener I'll have to be honest had me standing on my feet. Really solid. I don't think you
had time enough to work it through so the song is still open to interpretation. No comitment = 5
Value: 5

Total Score: 20

Song 3) Moa22 Burn With me
A) Recording Quaility
1) I think the vocal in the first verse is a little weak but sonically I think everything is top notch.
Total Value: 9

B) Production: Full production on this including goats and backing vocals that kill. That's all in
Total Value: 10

C) Vibe: I had to flip a coin because I can't vote against two of my boys...and @nige one. Vibe
goes down to a 7 because you have to lose. Sorry bro!

Total Score: 26

Song 4) Eric Tracks Through the night
A) Recording Qualitity
1) I had to turn the intro down because it came at me so loud. Can we just turn that guitar amp
down a little please. I like the vocals alot. Not sure on the quality of the whole thing...but I like the
vocal. Everything, drums, bass tone, vocal has that garage sound, not to say it can't be
sexified...but you didn't.
Total Value: 4

B) Production: It's a good song. It has a good feel and there are some good things that happen. I
feel like when you get late in the song it falls apart and your ideas there don't work or are dragged
on to long. Maybe the song is to long...I don't know
Total Value: 3

C) Vibe: It's fresh and original. It's clever in spots. Raw heart wins me over every time.
Total Value: 7

Total Score: 14

Song 5) KC22 Hyperthyroid
A) Recording Quality: I'm not feeling your drums at all. Weak kick, high hat is nowhere, and those
sexy tom fills haven't even been thought of yet. I like your lead rhythm guitar tone a lot. That lead
synth is sick. Really great idea and you committed to it. Backing synths are there but nothing that
impressive. So we have a midi drum kit that needs work, two good leads, and a horrible bass tone.

Total Value: 7

B) Production: No vocal -5. Just kidding. It's a solid idea. Like I said I really liked the two different
leads and that will be great building blocks for future collaboration. We both know the drums are
weak. -2 for the bad bass tone because I'm a bass player.
Total Value: 6

C) Vibe: I like it. I would track to it. Great ideas and changes
Total Value: 7

Total Score: 20

Song 6) Donkey Hugger In Orange
A) Recording Quality: Piano intro is tight. Sick metal Guitars! Love those pulls! Those drums. I
don't know. That vocal. Probably shouldn't be there.
Total Value: 7 only because of the bad vocal and the weak bass

B) Production: If your going to go big metal then you need to sound like big metal and you and I
know that is big production now. You got good feedback guitars and their tone is killer but song
composition....not there.
Total Value: 5

C) Vibe: I like it. It's what I listen to the most. I personally don't like the vocal. I feel it was pushed
and inappropriate.
Total Value: 5

Total Score: 17

End Results:
1) Nige King of Ashes 27
2) Moa22 Burn With Me 26
3) KCC Hyperthyroid 20
4) Ocotpus Heart of Stone 20
5) Donkey Hugger In Orange 17
6) Eric Tracks Through the Night 14

[Mister Fox]

First. I am going to listen to everyones mix as is. I'm not going to bring it into a DAW to check your
-18dbfs levels. I'm just to lazy. Do we really need that for this type of contest really? I don't know.
If your overly compressed and loud then lets just take points off you for being stupid.

Let me quote myself from earlier:

Mix(ing) Challenge:
- the focus is mixing, not mastering
- try to shoot for -18dBFS RMS avg to -15dBFS RMS avg for the perceived loudness (ideally, non higher than -16LUFS SLk avg)

Songwriting Competition
- you can do whatever you feel like
- try to shoot non higher than K-12 (-12dBFS RMS avg, K-System v1) or -14LUFS SLk avg (or ILk for the whole stream) as absolute maximum loudness wise

These are all recommendations!

What you do in the end, is ultimately up to you. If you want to go super-loud for the Songwriting Competition, so be it. At times of Loudness Normalization however, that is kind of a moot topic now. I definitely do not(!) recommend that route ("make things loud!") for the Mix(ing) Challenge.



Thanks for breaking the ice and being the first with your votes. Very detailed at that as well (did not expect that!). I still encourage everyone to give feedback. But if you want to keep it short and just list your (currently) Top 6 - that's just as fine. We're still doing baby steps with this competition after all.

Let's keep up the groove!

[Tbase2000]

Personally I just couldn't judge on someones creation without giving them a reason. That's a really hard thing to ask.

[Mister Fox]

Fair point

[Nige]

After much contemplation, deliberation and beer, this is where I managed to place all the entries, along with a few accompanying words for each.
A great job by all, well done.

#1 - "Burn With Me" - Moa22

Admittedly I had a small dog in this fight, by way of a few sporadic background vocals, but searching deep within my objective soul, taking myself out of the equation, still left me with a competently written/executed song, that frankly, is as far up my musical alley as you can get.
A tight and concise arrangement with a few clever surprises thrown in, big guitars, driving bass, well thought out drum patterns and of course, all that gravelly goodness in Tony's vocal ticked all the boxes for me.
And then those screaming goats just for some icing on the cake, screaming f*#king goats!!
I wasn't feeling the flute playing through the verses, and thought it seemed to serve no real benefit through those passages, otherwise, I really do find myself struggling to find things I dislike about this one.

#2 - Hearts of Stone - OctopussOnFire

I really dig that intro, right off the bat. It seems like a ton of work for sure.
I think the arrangement is solid and allows for the parts to flow fairly effortlessly, with star of the show for me being the string section, they sound convincing in the way they carry the suspense of the composition.
Although it's sometimes hard to get away from a midi drum sound, it's obvious you've put a great deal of work into keeping the song exciting through variations and clever accents.
The overall production is very kind on the ears, and makes for a nice listen, but in my opinion the guitars, while playing all the right notes, are sonically, quite off-putting.
Overall, when I look at this piece as a whole, I feel I'm only getting 3/4 of the story, like the stage has been set, but the lead forgot to show up and play the starring role.
Whether it be a vocal (the obvious choice), lead guitar, keys or whatever, I just feels like it's yearning for that big hooky 'something' on top, sending those tingles down your spine, not possible from a piece of background music alone.
A stand up effort with potential for so much more.

#3 - "Hyperthyroid" - KC23

Great guitar sound/performance and the overall production had me reeled in from the opening bar, although apart from the cymbals out wide, the drums felt a quite static with very little movement coming from the toms.
The impression I came away with was a LOT of really interesting parts, that as a complete entity, felt rather disjointed.
Take the first 1:06, expand on the whole lead melody motif, and base that around a 3 minute-ish, straight ahead alt-rock tune complete with hooky vocals and even a guitar solo thrown in for good measure and you've got a winner.
From 1:06 onward, when we open up into these beautiful Rick Wright-esque keyboards with those tight guitar rhythms feels like an entirely different beast altogether, and with a bit more time and thought to the arrangement and structure, could be a superb starting point for an epic prog number.
In summation, the first minute or so didn't convince me I was listening to an instrumental, and by the time I'd realized I was, the illusion had been ruined. Pick a theme, and run with it from start to finish. Great effort within the time constraints nonetheless.

#4 - "Big Stick" - Tbase2000

It's a little hard for me to step outside myself and try and talk objectively about this song, for the simple fact that I was heavily invested in it's inception, musically and creatively.
I think what Tony has managed to deliver is a fair and honest representation of the struggles that surrounded it, and every player involved put in 110% to get this to where it is now.
This is a fun song, with a feel-good attitude, dirty guitars, some hooky riffs and melodies with lot's of swearing and a killer vocal.
What more could you ask for in a song. (rhetorical question)

#5 - "Through The Night" - erictracks

I didn't have a problem with the guitar tone, as you mentioned in your OP, I actually thought the entire instrumentation, guitar(s)/vocal performance and production was on point, and made for a really pleasurable listen, with some real nostalgic Neil Young-ish moments poking through, which I loved.
The negative aspects for me were firstly the drum programming, especially that little snare triplet playing off the beat that seemed to break the rhythm and reminded you you weren't listening to a real drummer. And the second much bigger turnoff was the plodding arrangement, that felt like it never quite said what it had to, and had overstayed it's welcome just a little too long. This and the fact that there was no real vocal hook or chorus to jump into and make the listener sit up and take notice. To me it felt like a 4 minute verse with a few cool instrumental segues, that barely kept me going. I think the inclusion of a big vocal hook to define a chorus and good trimming of the fat would have resulted in a really memorable song. A solid effort all the same, props.


#6 - "In Orange" - Donkey Tugger

There's nothing I like more than a concise, 'to the point' track that says all that it needs to, drops the mic and heads straight for the bar. And this song delivers that completely. Couple this with an unconventional song structure, catchy guitar riffs and some distorted punk-metal screamings and this speaks my language all day long.
Unfortunately this is where the fairy tale ended for me, with the instrumentation being a huge hurdle that I just couldn't get my head around. Apart from the blatant pinch harmonic abuse, the music itself sounded as though it was composed within Guitar Pro™ or something robotic and sterile along those lines, which for me personally, is an instant and absolute musical turnoff.
The concept was a winner in every respect, however the manner in which it was served up to the listener... not so much.

[MOA22]

Congrats to everybody and thanx to Mix Challenge.
How it sounds, how is the arrangement then do i like it ?
So, my vote.

1# Nige, « King of Ashes »

Sounds really good, everything is nice there, well tracked, mixed in a smooth way (maybe a little bit gentle, nothing). The synths are there to help the left panned guitar !
Awesome frontman. The drums sound good, even if i would have prefer a less "metalish" snare. Have to admit the bass is really nice (a db more of it please). The thing i prefer is that it sounds natural, like it was easy to mix by moving some faders and pushing one or 2 buttons...

Arrangement. Well constructed, nothing to throw away, even the end is smart. Only one stuff, i would only have made a more progressive attenuation of the distortion on the lead singer in the beginning.

I like it because i like it. Like how you are able to produce a pretty complex rhythm/music that seems so easy...

2# TBase200, « Big stick »

Sounds really really good. Sonically compact, Just maybe a bit too much verb. Balanced and clear

Classical type song, but nice goodies, how much did you paid those Indians ? The near hardcore part is really nice and sits well in the song. Lead gtrs are just perfect. Well constructed vocals too.

I like the song mostly because it is really nasty, and it is a real groove lesson. Just wish you had time to track a complete and really convincing drums track.

3# erictracks « Through the night »

Sound pretty bad for me, you say your guitars don't sound good, but it actually sounds the best in your mix, with the vocals. The bass is too small, and the battery is aggressive and not deep enough (really hate it). Apart from that the whole is rather well balanced.

For the arrangement, there are big problems. The intro is ok, a little too aggressive but ok, the first verse seems too long, so it starts very well. There's something missing. And the pre chorus should be twice as short. The second verse is perfect. We get lost a little later, but it's the beginning that I don't think works. Drums are often poorly programmed, too "MIDI", it would have to be simpler. As Nige wrote, this triplet roll kills your drum part.

I've been tough on you because I really like this song. I find a little Bowie in all of this. And I think it could be a great song. I'm even ready to help you because I love this song so much.
Bravo

4# OctopusOnFire, « Hearts of Stone »

Sounds really good, even if it sounds MIDI, nothing else to say about that. A thing : gtrs are thin.

Arrangement, as a tribute of some Video games soundtracks, i am 100% ok with it. Really nicely done, the string part is really nice, The intro, WTF, WooooW ! A really nice part. Dark and slow…

I was very gentle because i don’t like the soundtrack you did. Mostly because of that MIDI Heavy Gtrs, that sound horrible and robotic. It sits well if you want the song to be played by the MIDI chip of a Megadrive… (even if it sounded not as good). You probably would be ranked at the 2nd or 3rd place with real guitars. Other than that, you know how to produce Octopuce !

5# kc23, « Hyperthyroid »

Sounds really good, just maybe too much comp on the drums and i am not fan of the cymbals sound. A really nice blend. I LOVE your organ, the lead synth is insane. The string moment is a bit hard, not clear… Other than that, good job

Arrangement, feels like listening to an old song of Moby, with a lot of guitars. I mean i wish i had more interaction within the different parts. The main melody is really good, but too many repetition for me. BTW, harmony 100 % OK, no problem. The strings crescendo makes me think about « Sowing the seeds of love ». Love that song.

I quite like it because it is really well made, but repetition killed me… Congrats !

6# donkey tugger, « In Orange »

I don't really like the sound of all this, the saturated guitars sound banks are improved now but I find it doesn't work. There's still too much missing. The voice is not well captured, and we don't understand much. The battery is not bad at all, but still lacks of natural.

Arrangement : not bad, ok with typical construction. Just you should put more vocals on it. Some Fear factory / Cannibal Corpse vibes in it. (the rising fx is from the Digimortal Album ?)

I dislike it because it sounds not really good for me (i prefer real guitars). By the way, nothing is bad in that comp.

______

Conclusion : very tough to write a huge text for a poor french like me. You guys did a good job. Feel free to bash my English and my work